Curse

AOD_EaSyKiLL · Jul 03, 2008, 09:32 PM // 21:32

Since we know Anet tried to fix Shadow Form again and mostly failed (it has had almost an opposite effect), I am creating this thread to get some suggestions for REALISTIC ways to alter Shadow Form to a less powerful, but still usable skill.

1. Remove -50% damage dealt, change functionality from "attacks miss" to "melee attacks do zero damage".

2. Change Shadow Form to a Stance. Increase Energy cost to 15, Decrease duration to 5-20 and recharge to 40 seconds. Change functionality to "attacks are blocked".

3. Two part:

Deadly Paradox: Your Assassin skills activate and recharge 33% faster. Disables non-assassin skills (20 seconds).

Shadow Form: Recharge changed to 45 sec. Remove -50% penalty

Im not asking for a /sign, just to get ideas out that the devs maybe didnt think of.

Panais · Jul 03, 2008, 09:49 PM // 21:49

this is just retarded.
u cant change other skills, so people wont farm UW with SF
personally i never used SF UW farming, other than just once to try it out

Miska Bow · Jul 03, 2008, 09:49 PM // 21:49

The recent nerf was not ment to kill the SF farming build, but more like tone it down to a reasonnable lvl of power.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 03, 2008, 09:53 PM // 21:53

1. No melee damage? That is worse then -50% damage dealt. Assassins in PvE are meant to be melee damage dealers mainly, I'd rather see "no damage from non-assassin skills" then "no melee damage," that is more appropriate for the farming builds as most didn't even use melee damage. However, both are rather bad, the -50% is good enough of a nerf there.

2. I don't see how Shadow Form could be a stance, instead it should be made into an Elite Form, however, that would ruin the concept of [[Signet of Disenchantment] being added. In other words, no to this as well.

3a. The Deadly Paradox is a buff and a nerf, would harm Perma SF farmers a lot more then the -50% damage. This is the only good idea here. However, the 20 second recharge is a bit long, make it 10 seconds.

3b. I think Arcane Echo would be the get-around to this. Might be wrong though, as Arcane Echo makes it 20+35ish, so 55 seconds till having to reuse, if I'm correct that is. making the recharge 60 seconds would be the solution to that.

However, Perma SF should just get a nerf in terms of Farming, as it helps with Running, no need to kill the runners (even though I dislike them) when they are not the problem.

The only worthwhile idea you suggest is 3a. but that still needs revising as well.

anonymous · Jul 03, 2008, 09:56 PM // 21:56

The 2 goals of your post are mutually exclusive. If you make it less powerful to the point where you can't farm with it, you have made it a useless skill. If you can still farm with it, then it isn't less powerful.

Axel Zinfandel · Jul 03, 2008, 09:56 PM // 21:56

What build other then this,

[SF farm;AnRhXU6nXIJ9xjoz0OhMgLczMMA]

Still works that dealing -melee- damage is a problem? Those changes don't nerf the skill at all. I just promotes grind for Dwarven Stability.

The blocking attacks part nerfs it to non use. You mine as well use Mist Form.

/fail

Mr.Bimble · Jul 03, 2008, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Return SF to its original and then sack the muppets that keep "improving skills"

AOD_EaSyKiLL · Jul 03, 2008, 10:07 PM // 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azazel The Assassin

1. No melee damage? That is worse then -50% damage dealt. Assassins in PvE are meant to be melee damage dealers mainly, I'd rather see "no damage from non-assassin skills" then "no melee damage," that is more appropriate for the farming builds as most didn't even use melee damage. However, both are rather bad, the -50% is good enough of a nerf there.

I didnt word it right I guess, what I mean is change the "attacks miss" to "attacks do no damage" which would mean SF and skills used during could be interuptable by melee and conditions could be aquired.

A stance would make wild blow and a few other skills as counters and would make other stances unusable, basically a major rework in a sense
.

AOD_EaSyKiLL · Jul 03, 2008, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by anonymous

The 2 goals of your post are mutually exclusive. If you make it less powerful to the point where you can't farm with it, you have made it a useless skill. If you can still farm with it, then it isn't less powerful.

They arent mutually exclusive, there is a middle ground where farming is still viable, but is not Uber. It just takes some balances in various skills and enemies and then it becomes like the 55 monk, or VwK where it has broad low imapct farming viability.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Still works that dealing -melee- damage is a problem? Those changes don't nerf the skill at all. I just promotes grind for Dwarven Stability.

The blocking attacks part nerfs it to non use. You mine as well use Mist Form.

/fail

You dont see the full potential. This changes it to a sort of tanking skill. the -50% damage is still there, but skills that trigger on hit, such Visages, and many melee attacks can be used with or against it.

Axel Zinfandel · Jul 03, 2008, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by AOD_EaSyKiLL

I didnt word it right I guess, what I mean is change the "attacks miss" to "attacks do no damage" which would mean SF and skills used during could be interuptable by melee and conditions could be aquired.

A stance would make wild blow and a few other skills as counters and would make other stances unusable, basically a major rework in a sense
.

way too much change for it's own good.

AOD_EaSyKiLL · Jul 03, 2008, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

way too much change for it's own good.

Add how you would like to see SF then, is basically what I am trying to get into this thread.

I would like it to become:

"101 ways to fix Shadow Form, that Anet hasn't tried already"

Maybe a mod could change the title to that. lol

Icy The Mage · Jul 03, 2008, 10:32 PM // 22:32

How about you just revert it to 21 seconds at 16 Shadow Arts? :P

Perma = A/Me

The "buffs" to SF destroyed pretty much everything that only maintains shadow form for a limited amount of time, eg. Solo Green Farmer, Shadow Raptor Farmer, etc... whilst leaving perma intact and powerful as ever >_>

Cyb3r · Jul 03, 2008, 10:46 PM // 22:46

this nerf fixed zero, and you're suggestion doesn't fix anything either the only thing it did was cutting down every other possible farm area for both A/E,A/Me, Me/A and E/A and turn more people to farming the ecto plains oh and the fix to the chaosplainz affected valid teams too that go in there and didn't tone down A/E in any way (ok less to kill but it didn't fix it)

Ecto was up to 5.5k after the nerf for less than a hour i think, why?
cause there is way more ecto than there is demand for it right now and people killing of they're stacks

Eradicus · Jul 03, 2008, 11:53 PM // 23:53

They should just let SF how it was and make it with the -50% dmg in the UW and fow....i was used to farm greens with my A with SF...now...just try to kick a monk boss *** with it :P i can't farm boss at all or..it take 20 min.

make it like PvP instanced....but with the -50% in UW and FOW..
I don't see the difference it would make with yesterday update...pls kill Ecto farm or slow it down but just don't kill boss farm...or making money become a useless waste of time.

Thanks.

toastgodsupreme · Jul 04, 2008, 12:40 AM // 00:40

You know, from your other posts on the board, I know you're not retarded. But this thread is fscking stupid.

All your suggestions have turned Shadowform into a non-ELITE skill.

Why is it the community is SOOOOOOO adamant on keeping monks as the only real farmers in the game? Nerf shadowform? Fine, nerf ALL farming by ALL classes. Put [signet of disenchantment] on any mob that's popular to be farmed by monks and dervishes. Put touch skills on any mobs that are farmed by VwK wars.

I just don't see why everyone, even seemingly intelligent people on this board, are out to nerf a skill into uselessness. What, are sins who run people through places bothering you now? Were those pesky shadow sliver ele's becomming a nuisance in Rata Sum?

And I STILL haven't farmed with my sin. Only R2 on survivor and not about to mess that up. So it's not like I'm benefitting from it.

Or is it that some of you have nothing better to do than cry about shit, regardless of whether or not it affects you?

"Shit, someone else is having fun in Guild Wars! OH HELL NO! I'M THE ONLY ONE ALLOWED TO HAVE FUN IN THIS GAME! That's getting nerfed! *posts on forums*"

Icy The Mage · Jul 04, 2008, 12:45 AM // 00:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by toastgodsupreme

You know, from your other posts on the board, I know you're not retarded. But this thread is fscking stupid.

All your suggestions have turned Shadowform into a non-ELITE skill.

Why is it the community is SOOOOOOO adamant on keeping monks as the only real farmers in the game? Nerf shadowform? Fine, nerf ALL farming by ALL classes. Put [signet of disenchantment] on any mob that's popular to be farmed by monks and dervishes. Put touch skills on any mobs that are farmed by VwK wars.

I just don't see why everyone, even seemingly intelligent people on this board, are out to nerf a skill into uselessness. What, are sins who run people through places bothering you now? Were those pesky shadow sliver ele's becomming a nuisance in Rata Sum?

And I STILL haven't farmed with my sin. Only R2 on survivor and not about to mess that up. So it's not like I'm benefitting from it.

Or is it that some of you have nothing better to do than cry about shit, regardless of whether or not it affects you?

"Shit, someone else is having fun in Guild Wars! OH HELL NO! I'M THE ONLY ONE ALLOWED TO HAVE FUN IN THIS GAME! That's getting nerfed! *posts on forums*"

I think you just won this thread.

Axel Zinfandel · Jul 04, 2008, 01:35 AM // 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by AOD_EaSyKiLL

Add how you would like to see SF then, is basically what I am trying to get into this thread.

I would like it to become:

"101 ways to fix Shadow Form, that Anet hasn't tried already"

Maybe a mod could change the title to that. lol

A practical solution to SF without vastly changing it's viability?

The only thing they can do without completely ruining it's maintainability is to add skill counters to UW, which they already have. Only thing I think they should do is to also add [Signet of Disenchantment] to Cursed Dream Riders themselves. The 50% less damage is not a nerf, but an annoyance.

Eradicus · Jul 04, 2008, 02:03 AM // 02:03

i still say they should instance SF at least.Don't kill the ones farmer that farm in some zones...bosses and such...
ok Slow ectos farm but c'mon,i can't even kill a boss now...surely not the monk one i was farming for tomes.
Ty Anet....

EDIT: It feels like theres only Ectos in this game...Ecto ECTO ECTOOO.... thought GW was more than that....

Luca Firestorm · Jul 04, 2008, 02:23 AM // 02:23

How about this: Take out -50% damage. Spells cast in Shadow Form take an extra 10 energy? Still leaves all the melee sin builds but slows down the sliver build in uw?

Or even -50% damage on spells...

I just really enjoyed doing UW speed runs, trying to break the record...now no1 is gonna even come close to that 15 min one...

Angelina Collins · Jul 04, 2008, 03:35 AM // 03:35

My suggestion is to return shadow form to it's original fuction. There was no need to nerf a skill based solely on farming builds, even if in a high profile area.

Next they need to reduce the ecto drop rate in the underworld, or reduce the number of creatures that drop ecto's in the chaos plains, maybe a combination of both.

The problem with this skill change is that it effects the use of the skill altogether, making it usless for anything else other then farming.

This behavior Anet is taking only shows how they tend to cater to one side of GW players, namely the ones who exploit the game in the first place. If this is Anets approach to solve problems, I have a good feeling that GW2 will = fail when realesed. Who wants to invest in a companies products when they delibertly downgrade then to satify the needs of the minorty.

I would rather spend my money on other games the offer the same and upgrade there games to make them more playable and fun. Anet's approach tends only to allinate players in the long run, resulting in disinterest in the game and future products.

Anet, do yourself a favor, come up with more abjective ways of improving your game with out downgrading skills, spells, or abilities, that lead to disatifaction of your product. I would be willing to except a price freeze on ectos at 5K if it would mean bring back showdow form to it's original funtion.